Keynote
Agentic AI Is the Next Big Step in Generative AI
Dr. Simon Harrer, Co-Founder & CEO @ Entropy Data · Software Architecture Summit, Berlin ·
Eleven months after Opus 4.5, I do everything with agents, and I no longer write code myself. In this evening keynote, I show what changed in how we build software: feedback loops that let agents review their own work, skills that encode our guidelines, reports that replace code reviews, and agents that are started automatically. I introduce loop architecture as a way to find these loops in your own landscape, share what agentic AI means for me as a CEO, and explain why the much bigger opportunity is agents automating business processes on governed enterprise data.
Note: The talk was delivered in German. The transcript below is an English translation, lightly edited for readability.
Thanks to the Software Architecture Summit for the opportunity, and to everyone who stayed for the long Q&A.
Q&A
Questions from the audience after the talk, translated and condensed.
Q: Your company was founded last year, everything is greenfield and runs smoothly. What is your plan for three to five years from now, when you have a bug and nobody understands the code anymore?
Our software is actually four years old. We were spun off a year ago, but the code base goes back four years. So it is not completely greenfield. It grew a lot over those years, including a time when the AI was not that good, and there is legacy code from back then.
So far, there were moments when I thought: we need to clean up, we need to invest. But currently it is all fix forward. That is a hypothesis: models get better, tools get better, so why should fix forward not work? At the same time, classic practices still apply. We cut packages per domain concept, which also makes the application easier for the agent to understand, and we keep that structure. That is how you keep complexity and blast radius under control. Everything you know as a software architect, you can still use.
We also keep the code very simple. Honestly: I would rather duplicate code than introduce the wrong abstraction. If a snippet is in the system ten times, I don't care. The AI adapts it. What matters to me is to avoid the German angst of "we must do everything like before".
Q: I work at a large bank with many legacy systems. Small adapters work great with AI. But as soon as I have to extend the big ball of mud, it gets interesting.
There you are missing the feedback loops and the safety nets that let you act safely at all. Even without AI, you have the same problem: how do you act safely in a big ball of mud? Once you have a good system with good feedback loops, it works. It does not depend on the AI, it depends on the general conditions.
What I noticed is that over time you think bigger, because building has become so cheap. The implementation takes the same time, but the result is much bigger. So with a legacy system: think big. How do I get it under test? How do I make it stable? How do I limit the blast radius? Maybe you start the system three times, or generate a huge corpus of tests from anonymized cases or account transactions. How do I get a billion transactions out of my core banking system as test data, and how do I anonymize them so I am allowed to use them? Think really big, because the machine can handle the implementation effort. You cannot afford to think small anymore.
Q: You said you hire AI-native juniors. Could it also be that in large organizations people with deep domain knowledge are the better choice? An AI-native junior I would not have to train much on AI, but on the domain.
Exactly. The junior brings the AI skills, the very experienced principal brings the domain knowledge. Both are great, and when in doubt, you bring them together.
What also matters to me right now: you want people with energy and passion. If someone is skeptical of AI, they are out right away. That is what speaks against some seniors: they are still stuck in the old world and have not arrived in the new one. They are somewhere in between, want to keep their status and salary, and at the same time are afraid of losing their job. What matters is the signal: this is an exciting new world, and I want to be part of it. If you can signal and show that, it works. That was put very bluntly, but it describes my perspective. And with a great senior, of course, you can talk.
Q: You said it has to be clear what you build. In our consulting work, the customer often does not know what their processes look like, and you have to work out what can be represented in the applications at all.
I have no perfect solution for that. All of this works extremely well for people who have their own product. What you want are product engineers: developers who take part ownership of the whole product. For that, they have to get into the domain, so they can make decisions themselves. Only then do you get the effect.
As a product owner, you can supply two developers at most, with AI. That is an absolute limit. They fire so many questions at you that you cannot think that fast. So you have to turn it around: give them freedom, boxes in which they may think and decide. That only works if they know the domain. The days when one product owner supplied seven developers are over. It is more like teams of two, maybe teams of three.
We hired two people at the beginning of the year. They are super engineers, but they did not know the data world. Our biggest problem is teaching them that domain knowledge quickly, so they take ownership. Otherwise I keep getting pull requests, I ask for my report, and the report shows it is all over the place because the domain was not understood.
Q: Then shouldn't we replace the product owner with an AI? If I feed the AI with all the domain content, I don't need a product owner.
I do not think we are there. You still have to make decisions and say this way is better, that way is not so good. That is my feeling right now. The AI does not have that knowledge yet. You would have to make everything explicit, so the AI has the information to make or prepare these decisions. In most cases, that knowledge is not explicit but implicit, in people's heads.
You could say: we solve that by making everything explicit, pulling it out of people, and then we do not need them anymore. That is rather dystopian. But I once talked to a venture capitalist from the US who only invests in companies where he sees that they pull the knowledge out of people's heads in order to replace them later. Ruthlessly consistent, and it struck me back then. But it goes exactly in the direction you describe.
Q: Why is it bad when the knowledge is extracted from domain experts, but positive when it is extracted from software developers? Why the difference?
Exciting question, and you are right, it is exactly the same. These skill repositories are our knowledge: how do I build a good Spring Boot service, how do I build a good architecture. We are making ourselves redundant with them. And product owners can learn to build large skill repositories just as well. I had honestly never thought about it that way. Thank you for that.
Q: When the moment of cost truth comes for the American AI companies, couldn't token prices rise exponentially and create completely different cost structures?
I cannot say. It is a certain risk. We handle it through budgeting: for next year we calculate 12,000 euros per person per year, and after that 24,000, for development alone. I cannot estimate it. We see different currents: Chinese models are so much cheaper than the American ones. How subsidized are they, how subsidized are the American models, how much will our demand grow, how fast will hardware be built so we can run models locally and pay a fixed price instead of per token? I do not know what will happen.
Right now, honestly, we are riding the wave. We use the Claude subscription because it is heavily subsidized. Economically, it would be stupid not to. Over the last twelve months we benefited enormously, and we would be clearly worse off had we not done it. Keeping an eye on the risk is good, but I would act the same way again. I would not hoard hardware as a countermeasure. I would react when it comes. We could go back to the stone age and code ourselves again. We all still can. But I do not believe that is coming back. It is like a trapdoor: we fell through, and we are not going back.
Q: A small team has become very powerful. But couldn't capital win in the end? Huge companies could buy billions of tokens and simply re-implement the products of small successful companies instead of acquiring them.
That can happen. But funnily enough, our biggest competitor right now is a different one. We talk to customers, and they say: great that you have this software, but we are a large enterprise, we are always a bit different, and we have two people who are eager to build it themselves, in a minimal version. As a software vendor, you have no chance to argue against that. If those two people really want it, you cannot fight these internal champions. Maybe it fails in two years, because they made their career with it and want to move on, and then nobody is left to operate it. We see that happening in many places. People would rather go to the hardware store and do it themselves than call a company that does it for them, keeps doing it with passion, gives you a service contract, and evolves the software with the market.
That makes customer access even more important. A great product is not enough. What matters a lot right now is reputation and expert status, being the go-to person in a field. People do not buy the software so much as the people who are known for it, so they cannot go wrong. You cannot convince with the feature list anymore, or hardly. You convince through reputation, content, thought leadership. People buy from people: from the one who helps develop the OpenTelemetry standard, because they know it best. If I do a classic product evaluation today, I find thousands of products that all claim to do it, and every day two more appear, half of them maintained by a single person.
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